Posted by: edhensley | April 25, 2010

Iron Chariots Too Powerful For God


Joshua 17(New International Version)

16 The people of Joseph replied, “The hill country is not enough for us, and all the Canaanites who live in the plain have iron chariots, both those in Beth Shan and its settlements and those in the Valley of Jezreel.” 17 But Joshua said to the house of Joseph—to Ephraim and Manasseh-“You are numerous and very powerful. You will have not only one allotment 18 but the forested hill country as well. Clear it, and its farthest limits will be yours; though the Canaanites have iron chariots and though they are strong, you can drive them out.”

Judges 1
Israel Fights the Remaining Canaanites

1 After the death of Joshua, the Israelites asked the LORD, “Who will be the first to go up and fight for us against the Canaanites?”

2 The LORD answered, “Judah is to go; I have given the land into their hands.”

3 Then the men of Judah said to the Simeonites their brothers, “Come up with us into the territory allotted to us, to fight against the Canaanites. We in turn will go with you into yours.” So the Simeonites went with them.

4 When Judah attacked, the LORD gave the Canaanites and Perizzites into their hands and they struck down ten thousand men at Bezek. 5 It was there that they found Adoni-Bezek and fought against him, putting to rout the Canaanites and Perizzites. 6 Adoni-Bezek fled, but they chased him and caught him, and cut off his thumbs and big toes.

17 Then the men of Judah went with the Simeonites their brothers and attacked the Canaanites living in Zephath, and they totally destroyed the city. Therefore it was called Hormah. 18 The men of Judah also took Gaza, Ashkelon and Ekron—each city with its territory.

19 The LORD was with the men of Judah. They took possession of the hill country, but they were unable to drive the people from the plains, because they had iron chariots.


The LORD was able to drive out people from Canaan, except for those with iron chariots? Iron chariots are therefore more powerful than God! Imagine how even more powerful this God would be against tanks, airplanes, and missiles. Furhtermore this contradicts what was said in Joshua 17.

I looked at http://www.apologeticspress.org/articles/561, and they admit that it appears to be a contradiction. But then they use some bizarre logic to come up with two (really three) possible apologies. Although they are unable (and unwilling) to claim which is correct, they conclude that because they can imagine possible solutions that there is therefore no contradiction.

After reading the two verses, it may look like they contradict one another.

These two passages have several plausible ways of reconciliation. And, please remember that the exact way to reconcile any contradiction need not be pinpointed, as long as a possible way can be provided. The rest of this brief answer will deal with only two of the many possible ways to reconcile the passages.


Using this absurd logic, anyone can make any book contradiction free. Would these Christians permit the Muslims to use the same logic on the Koran?

The apologists then list two possible apologies and conclude there is no contradiction. However, anyone who reads these passages honestly can only conclude that there is a clear contradiction. Verse 19 above gives the ONLY REASON LISTED: “because they had iron chariots.” Any other reasons are due to IMAGINATION and not due to what is written in this passage.


Responses

  1. Your commentary on Iron chariots, brings up another question i often ponder…

    Why is it with God and all his infinite wisdom never gave any technology to the Jews ? Why is it he cant handle iron chariots ? Why couldnt he give the Jews a better writing system so the whole nonsense about not being able to say the holy name >YHWH< because it is unknown, would not have happened ? It sounds worrying that God wanted everyone to honour his name, and yet he couldnt teach the Jews to write it down accurately.

  2. God did get rid of the Pharaoh and his chariots in Exodus.

    (YLT )Exodus 14
    “26 And Jehovah saith unto Moses, `Stretch out thy hand toward the sea, and the waters turn back on the Egyptians, on their chariots, and on their horsemen.’

    27 And Moses stretcheth out his hand towards the sea, and the sea turneth back, at the turning of the morning, to its perennial flow, and the Egyptians are fleeing at its coming, and Jehovah shaketh off the Egyptians in the midst of the sea,

    28 and the waters turn back, and cover the chariots and the horsemen, even all the force of Pharaoh, who are coming in after them into the sea — there hath not been left of them even one.”

    This is scripture of the miracle where the chariots were thrown into the sea.

    There are pictures of chariot wheels at the bottom of the Red Sea, btw.

    1 Corinthians 1:27 but the foolish things of the world did God choose, that the wise He may put to shame; and the weak things of the world did God choose that He may put to shame the strong;

    MP, the above scripture may explain why they had very little technology in comparison to their neighbors.

    The Canaanites were defeated later.
    Judges 4
    “14 And Deborah saith unto Barak, `Rise, for this [is] the day in which Jehovah hath given Sisera into thy hand; hath not Jehovah gone out before thee?’ And Barak goeth down from mount Tabor, and ten thousand men after him.

    15 And Jehovah destroyeth Sisera, and all the chariots, and all the camp, by the mouth of the sword, before Barak, and Sisera cometh down from off the chariot, and fleeth on his feet.”

    • Thank you for showing that Exodus contradicts Joshua. You are doing a great job at proving the bible is full of errors!

  3. There is no contradiction. It shows lack of faith by the people God has, over & over again, saved by fighting their battles. You need to read to chapter 4:13, where Sisera and his 900 iron chariots were utterly defeated. God made this world and all the worlds we have no idea that exist. “The Fool hath said in his heart, there is no God …”

    • The defeat of the people in the plains was not due to lack of faith, but because they had iron chariots. Judges 1 says nothing about lack of faith.

  4. David Shaffer explain this. The earliest translation and commentary on the bible by Yonatan Ben Uziel (circa 50 BCE), into Aramaic, paraphrases this verse : “But after they had sinned, they were unable to drive out the inhabitants of the plain.” As others here have mentioned, the whole book of Judges 1 when read in context, is about the victories and failures of the tribes of Israel when concurring the land. Through out the book it is clear that those failures are a direct result of Israel’s sins or lack of faith in G-d’s assistance. This was explained well by others here, I just wanted to point out that this was always the understanding of this verse going back to the earliest sources.

    • Then the literal word of god is wrong. We should change all versions of the current bible and replace it with this ARAMAIC PARAPHRASE. Very funny.


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